Tony's Lifted story

Speaker 1 1:14

Hello , hello and welcome to this week's conversation on the Low no Drinker podcast , bringing you closer to the people , places and brands leading the low no and light alcohol revolution . My guest today is Tony Robinson . Tony is one half of the husband and wife founder team behind Lifted , a 0.0% high protein craft lager made for athletes . There is a lot of talk at the moment in the Lono space about the connection between choosing a life less intoxicated and the health implications of alcohol and non-alcoholic drinks , and Tony and his team have created a product that sits right in the center of that conversation . It's low calorie , it's vegan , as I said , it's high protein . It's a one of a kind offering and today we're going to have a chat about the story , about how this brand came to be , the challenges of being in a category of one and what the future looks like for Lifted . And so far , with over 250,000 cans sold to date , I'm guessing the future is looking up . Get it Because they're called lifted . Looking up , right ? I'm sorry I couldn't help it , hi , tony .

Speaker 2 2:24

Very good .

Speaker 1 2:26

How are you doing , darling ? Thank you for joining me .

Speaker 2 2:28

I'm doing great . Thank you very much . Thank you for that great introduction .

Speaker 1 2:31

I don't need to say anything else .

Speaker 2 2:32

You've just done it . That's it . End of the show . Thanks for coming .

Speaker 1 2:38

No , listen , I think it's really , really interesting , uh , and , by the way , the cheesy jokes might not stop there . I , I am a fan of a cheesy 80s one-liner , um , but yeah , no , I think it's really interesting what you've done . I think it's really exciting in this space . I think that , um , as I said , you're in a category of one , as far as my research has revealed , uh , and that's got to be quite challenging in and of itself . So , before we get into all that , I always like to ask start by asking my guest to share the adventure , really , that led you to launch the brand . So , start where you want to start . What was the journey that got you here ?

Speaker 2 3:09

cool , yeah , so , um , so it's myself and my wife who are the co-founders , so team of two and um , we both kind of came up with the idea or went into it , for different reasons , I suppose . So , um , from my wife's side , rebecca she's a lifelong vegetarian . She's very bored of all the options up until recently that you would get in a menu and very found it very difficult to get additional protein into her diet . She's very much like myself in terms of she likes physical activity , likes going to the gym , still weight active , and you know , getting protein to diet was hard . There's only so many beans you can eat .

Speaker 2 3:45

So , uh , exactly , so , um , so she came at it from the angle of you know how do I get additional protein to my diet in a clean way that is good for me , that's low in calorie and from from my size . Um , I was going to gym a lot . I've been training for like 20 odd years . Um , last five or six years I've been doing crossfit at like a semi-competitive level , wow and I was already kind of making the decision to shift from my alcoholic beverages to non-alcoholic beverages .

Speaker 2 4:14

Like young family didn't want to wake up with a muzzy head , the kind of the normal reasons , but also training pretty hard and , you know , undoing all my work , I would then shift into alcohol-free options and as I was drinking those alcohol-free beers , they then started to feel a little bit like I'm having these calories but I'm not kind of getting anything back in return from it . So if I'd have like four cans of alcohol-free beer , for example , I might be having 300 calories and it just felt a little bit empty . And then I would go on and have a protein shake later in the day or a grenade bar or whatever it might be , to kind of bump up my , my macros and , um , it just felt like a a really good fit for where we were in life and what we were actually experiencing .

Speaker 2 4:56

So we came up with the idea you know , we would just constantly you know , me and my wife always come up with lots of ideas and we've had a product-based business in the past . Um , you know what , what trends are happening , and there's these huge macro trends , right where you've got people are enjoying , um , going to the gym much more than they ever used to . The fitness revolution in terms of , you know , fitness is not about just going to the gym and going home , it's about , you know , socializing . It's about , um , music , it's very connected to , like you know , pop culture . The fit just and the timing just felt right to bring out this product , which is kind of hitting these huge macro trends . You've got people wanting to increase the amount of protein that they have , yet reduce the amount of meat they want to eat . So there's all these trends that came together and we felt that by coming up with this idea and this product , we we kind of hit a lot of things all at once I think you definitely did .

Speaker 1 5:47

You made some really good , good points and I like what you say about . You know , fitness and and health is is no longer just about going and getting as jacked as possible or getting as skinny as possible . You know that that super huge guy and that size zero girl thing is kind of phasing out now , as people are looking after themselves more holistically and trying to find ways to incorporate different elements of their lifestyle to all add up to a healthier way of being , rather than just going , like a lot of people listen to this show you . You know they're not necessarily going , never drinking alcohol again , they're going . I want to be able to make some healthier choices at those times that suit , and I think that this fits in really well with that that's kind of where we come up with our , our line , which is brewed for the stronger you .

Speaker 2 6:33

And it's just we're brewed for the stronger version of yourself , right , and it doesn't just relate to just having this one singular beer . It's all of those decisions , all those rituals , all those habits that you make as an individual that make you stronger , better version of yourself , wherever it's fitness , wise , professional , family life , whatever it might be , we're brewed for a stronger version of you I like that , I really like that .

Speaker 1 6:53

So tell me then about the process of creating the beer . Now , obviously I'm not asking you to give out any proprietary secrets , but , um , you know there's a lot of . I've done a few episodes on this podcast about functional drinks and , and you know I've had some experts in different fields sort of talking about how drinks can be made , but nobody has spoken to me about protein . So sort of ,

Making an alcohol-free protein lager

Speaker 1 7:16

from start to to where you are now , as much as you can , what's the process of making a protein beer ?

Speaker 2 7:24

so a lot of testing , as you might imagine , and you said , we are kind of in a category by ourselves . I think that's why because it's been a long journey and a difficult one and a lot of testing which has cost us a lot of capital , but eventually we've got into a place where we are really happy with kind of what we've produced and and kind of how the product is and how well it's been received . Um , but it just started with literally first thing was get a scoop of protein mix into your beer .

Speaker 1 7:52

How does it taste right that ?

Speaker 2 7:54

that .

Speaker 1 7:55

That's the first thing and then , and then it was okay .

Speaker 2 7:57

What other proteins can I ? Can I buy and start mixing into other non-alcoholic beers ? And that was where it started you know , very , very simple , just um testing uh . But then from there we worked with some consultants , um , who helped us , kind of like it , brew , uh , a zero percent beer , because we were like really keen .

Speaker 1 8:13

We were keen that we wanted to be there are a few things we wanted to hit with this , and 0.0 percent was something that we really wanted to hit , because we felt like , if it's a fitness product which it is we didn't want it to have any alcohol in it which could be classed as a toxin , because we just felt like it just messed with our brand uh story and messed , messed with our message .

Speaker 2 8:37

We really wanted to hear that and we really wanted it to be vegan or vegetarian , because Rebecca's coming out from this vegetarian angle . We've had a lot of feedback from our customers saying we love your product because it is those two things and actually they don't necessarily mind the protein , that's just an additional benefit . It actually comes to us for a different reason . So we really wanted to do that and it was . It started off with a consultant . He helped us and then , once the consultant kind of passed us like the ip and the recipe , we then started to work very closely with brewery . So we still have the same brewery that we work with right from the beginning , right up until this point now , and I can't give away too much on the brewing process .

Speaker 2 9:45

Um , I said we have done a lot to get it to where it is , but the crux of it was using high quality products , high quality ingredients , and we had to source a protein that was completely soluble . That was one challenge . So we don't have a cloudy look , we don't have to look milky . We don't want fruit to feel like it with a protein shake . It had to be completely solubleble . Um had to be clear . Um also had to um have like either a sweet or a bitter taste , because that way we could work with it with regards to the beer profile , because beer is like that balance of sweet and bitter um . So we started off for a long time having pea protein which was like much more of a bitter taste , and we were able to work with that and we eventually transferred it to a rice protein which is a much more sweet taste .

Speaker 1 10:32

Um , and now we're kind of balancing out that with the the rest of the brewing process wow , it sounds like it must have been quite a , like you say , a trial and error sort of process . I love the fact that you're very honest and said look , it started off with a scoop of protein powder , because I guess where else do you start ? Right , like you just got to figure it out yeah um , so tell me then , uh , for those watching .

Speaker 1 10:57

Uh , I've got a few cans here behind me . Let me show that to the screen . So lovely , um design . It's very simple , it's very clear . Uh , tell me what it tastes like , because I think people are going to want to know what does a protein beer taste like ? So what's the flavor profile ?

Speaker 2 11:11

yeah . So first of all , um , you can't taste the protein , okay , so that's that's . One thing is that it doesn't taste like a protein shake .

Speaker 2 11:17

It's not chalky or milky or like gritty or anything like that okay , so I think the flavor profile is like it's quite malt forward , um , it's quite quite a malty beer . Then we have some kind of like , uh , like noble hops in it . So it's more of a like pills in a feel . But it's very crisp and it's very refreshing because we want it to be drunk at that moment when you've smashed a workout , finished a run , you're hot and you're sweaty and you go , ah , dying for a beer . That's when you drink it , when you have , you have it , then it is the best Like it is so good . So , yeah , it's crisp , it's refreshing , more like a Pilsner-style beer .

Speaker 1 11:54

Okay , okay , and I was going to ask that was going to be one of my questions like who is it for and what occasions is it for ? Because obviously you mentioned that you

Who's drinking non-alcoholic protein beer?

Speaker 1 12:03

do a fair bit of CrossFit . For Obviously , you mentioned that you do a fair bit of CrossFit . For anyone who doesn't know , crossfit is just sort of crazy intense weights and bodyweight exercises and madness . Go and check it out . It's so much fun to watch , but I can imagine . But it's a very social sport as well . You don't do it in a gym , you do it in something called a box and you all do it together as a group , as opposed to individual workouts . So is this sort of like part of the end of that ? You're all sitting there together . You're all sort of all lying on the floor dying , cracking a beer . Is it more for a runner ? Is it more for the solo um sports person ? Who do you see drinking this ?

Speaker 2 12:39

100 . Great question . Um , it's , it's . It's just like beer , social . It's not necessarily meant to be drink drunk , you know . By by itself it's supposed to be social . That's at least how we sit , and we have two main types of places where this is drunk . So it is at the end of a event , okay . So if you've just done something which is a big achievement , um , that's when it's drunk or like in that social setting at the end of a day at the CrossFit gym , that is when , um , when it's yeah that's when it was made to be consumed .

Speaker 2 13:08

In those moments where you want to increase that sense of community , you want to have , you know , friends that have just done something together have that sense of accomplishment coming together . Their endorphins are already high . That crack of a beer like keeps that kind of vibe and energy going . So that that's , that's the one area and we do a lot of events and kind of at the end of events people are finished for the day . That's when they really come to us and get that ice cold beer feeling and the second place where it gets drunk a lot is just in the home . So we have a lot of tags on Instagram and social media of people in front of TV watching football , for example , like the classic , like feet up can of lifted in the hand .

Speaker 2 13:47

You know what better way to spend the day watching x , whatever it is . And that is , I think , something we didn't expect . We thought it was going to be much more drink in that social setting , but actually it's something that people are unwinding with at home . I think they're just swapping out the either regular beer or a regular alcohol-free beer and going I'm watching football , I'm gonna have a beer , but it's gonna have protein in it as well , and it's like if I was already the same journey I was on , if I'm already drinking alcohol-free beer , why would I not have one that was , you know , better for me or macro friendly ?

Speaker 1 14:18

yeah , absolutely , and I love that you can have it whilst you're after you've participated in sports or just watching other people doing it he covered both ends .

Speaker 1 14:27

My husband just did a , a tough mudder . We both we love doing tough mudders . This was his fourth . I've only done two , uh , and he got really excited when I told him that I was speaking to you . Because he got really excited because he was like , oh , maybe that that's the kind of thing that might have at the end of the race . So when you do these obstacle races , uh , they always have a couple of free drinks for people because obviously they're exhausted . But I can really see something like lifted being in that sort of space , you know , and really , um , jumping into that sort of , uh , public sportsmanship , camaraderie sort of occasion , like some other brands that are well , obviously there's the huge brand from the states who made their sort of Well , obviously there's the huge brand from the States who made their sort of name by being part of sports , and I could definitely see that being a perfect fit for something like Lifted .

Speaker 2 15:13

Yeah it's 100 percent the direction we want to go in . All that stuff just costs a lot where we're currently not quite there yet . So we're trying to do things like free events where we can go and there's maybe's , say , 500 people rather than 5 000 people and we can pitch up for free , we can build our audience , we can speak to the consumer , we can meet them where they're at , we can , um , probably sell rather than give away and we can um still get people to experience the product , um , still get some great content and still , like , build our audience , but without necessarily doing it at those really big events just yet . But if I was going to say like , if we were going to align to a sport , it would probably be something like High Rocks Community .

Speaker 2 15:57

Because of that you know what I said before this you know people that want to achieve basically that team spirit , because you can do it singly , but a lot of people do it in twos or they do it in , um , yeah , in fours , and it's just that community of people that want to do , to do better , and they find fitness fun like that's . That's who we want to . You know , like you say , with yourself and the top model , it's a challenge , but it's fun like that , otherwise you wouldn't keep going back for more . And , uh , we eventually want to meet our customer right there at the end of that that race and give them that post-race feeling yeah , yeah , uh , high rocks is , uh , looks intense .

Speaker 1 16:34

It's sort of like a . It's a cross between like what is it ? How do you like obstacles and crossfit and just intense team workouts , right yeah I'll give you the very brief , brief rundown of it .

Speaker 2 16:49

It's a uh , I think it's eight or ten stations and in between every station you do a 1k run . So you do like a sled pull 1k run , sled push 1k run , and then you come back you do a row 1k run , so on and so forth and um , it's just such a hugely popular race and you can do it in a pair , you can do it individually , we can do it four , but when you go there the music is pumping . They've got all the vendors there . People don't just turn up and go , they turn up and they stay , and you know , um , it's amazing , it's really great .

Speaker 2 17:18

So that type of sporting event is like perfect for us it's just way out of scope , but it's for the time being yeah , I can imagine , I can remember .

Speaker 1 17:26

First of all , that definitely sounds like the kind of thing you'd need a beer afterwards so that perfect fit .

Speaker 1 17:30

But yeah , you're right , you know , and I think one thing a lot of people , that founders that come on the show , I like that you're all quite honest and open about the fact that , excuse me , these things cost money , right ? It's not just , oh , you know you should be here and you should be there . It's like , well , actually you have to pay to play , right , and you have to put your hand in your pocket first

250,000 cans sold so far

Speaker 1 17:49

before you get the chance to get that exposure and and it's not easy for for a small brand , but you guys are doing quite well . I mentioned in the opening that you've sold over 250 000 cans so far . Is that accurate ?

Speaker 2 18:01

yes , yes , yeah that's huge .

Speaker 2 18:05

I feel like what we found with our customers is that they're incredibly loyal . So we have over 70% of our customers returning for another case and the average customer of ours orders 3.9 cases . So we have a really loyal fan base , people that get it and make it part of their ritual and understand it . Once they've , I think , had it same as like if I have a regular non-alcohol beer . Now I feel a bit shortchanged almost , because I'm not getting the benefit out of it , and I think that's what happens to our customer base . They see it , they try it , they love it and they love it put it as part of their ritual even though it's a little bit more expensive .

Speaker 2 18:48

They put that aside and go this is a really good product , um , and they uh continue to buy , so that helps us with that . 250 000 cans sold I don't know what the number is now . It's obviously grown um a little since since we spoke um , but it has um .

Speaker 1 19:05

It has helped having a good product and a loyal customer base so you mentioned there that it might be a little bit more expensive . What's the current RRP and what is it

Customers & costs

Speaker 1 19:17

that contributes to why you feel that that's where it needs to be positioned ?

Speaker 2 19:21

Yeah , so we're £25 , plus delivery , if you subscribe and save . Or we're £35 if you just buy it one-off , and we positioned it that way to make the subscribe and save like a 35 pound . Um , if you just buy it one off , and we positioned it that way to make the subscribe and save like a no-brainer , we want people to subscribe , to subscribe , cancel anytime . It's really easy like it's not a yeah , a gimmick to get people in . It's just we wanted to position it that way and , um , what makes it expensive ? Um , so , let's say , a regular non-apoholic beer would probably cost you in the region between 45p and 60p if you were like a new brand with like a 3,000 litre tank , something like that probably closer to a 60p for a regular non-alcoholic beer to be produced .

Speaker 2 20:02

For us , because we have the additional protein that is a huge , huge part of our cost it's probably 40% of our cost is the protein itself . So our beer costs more like a pound to manufacture rather than 60p . So therefore , then you start to add in the cost of the cans , the labels , the boxes . It ends up being a fairly expensive endeavor to produce it . So we wanted to produce something that had , they said , a really high grade protein in it . That was something that ticks all the boxes that we that we wanted . So we could have gone down like a collagen route or a bovine route . That'd be much , much cheaper . But we didn't want to isolate , um like that part of the market . And , as I said at the start , rebecca is a vegetarian and she loves having a can of lifted . I don't think she can live without it . Now , um so , um again , we didn't want to go down that route , even though we knew that we could probably like save some some cost .

Speaker 1 20:58

Yeah , and and is it a de-alcoholized uh beer base or brewed to zero percent ?

Speaker 2 21:05

it's um . There's no fermentation happening , so it's it's brewed to zero percent yeah okay .

Speaker 1 21:10

So I mean , and all of that , you know , it all adds to the cost , doesn't it ? Because there's no fermentation happening , so it's brewed to 0% . Okay , and all of that , it all adds to the cost , doesn't it ? Because it's not just the fact that you're making a beer , it's that you're making it differently from a full-strength beer . So already the production of a non-alcoholic beer is more , and people don't often recognize why that is and obviously all the costs and implications and , uh , you know all the things that add to that . And then you're also adding the protein on top , plus all the r and d that has to go into it . So it is . I can imagine it's just cost on top of cost . You , you mentioned it was 25 or 35 , that's for a case of how many that's 12 12 .

Speaker 1 21:46

Okay , perfect , yeah , um , I normally do this closer to the end , but as we're talking about it , so if people do , having heard all this , and they think right , you know what , I need to go and check that out . I need to go and try it . Let's tell them now where they can go to find it . What's the website and the socials .

Speaker 2 22:01

Yeah , so wwwliftedbrewingcom , so you can go there to buy it . If you want to check it out on socials , it's lifted underscore brewing on Instagram and just lifted brewing on TikTok .

Speaker 1 22:14

OK , all right , perfect .

Speaker 2 22:15

And there you'll see lots of sweaty pictures of me and some other stuff mixed in .

Speaker 1 22:22

Well , it's worth a visit for that . It's the blood , sweat and tears that goes into the workout and the beer . I will make sure that's all in the show notes . I will remind people of that later on as well . Why do you think you're in a category of one , Tony ? Why do you think nobody else has cottoned on

A category of one

Speaker 1 22:42

to this combination yet ?

Speaker 2 22:46

I'm not entirely sure . I'm waiting for someone else . I am waiting for this competition . I'm really surprised . You mentioned the other brand that are focused on athletes , and I feel like it's a matter of time before someone comes in and does this as well . But it may be just the fact that it is more difficult , and I think that's the only reason I can come up with is that it has been difficult to manufacture it . I suppose the other thing is it is quite a challenger to the market thing to have done .

Speaker 2 23:24

Yeah , because beer and health , typically , they just don't go together , like beer , is not known for being a healthy product .

Speaker 2 23:34

Even the non-alcoholic beer , although you're doing it for health reasons , it's not particularly a healthy product . I think it's potentially that crossover between health and beer just hasn't happened yet . You think about almost every single other drink in the world . There's healthy versions of it or versions with , I don't know , lion's mane , magnesium , um , caffeine , whatever it might be . There's , there's versions of it that make you a better , better version of you or help with you , whether it be for focus or sleep or clarity of mind or whatever , and beer is like the only one that doesn't have that . So , before you know , we feel like we're a challenger brand , challenging not just the non-alcoholic market but actually the alcoholic market as well . We're really going right up against them and , um , I think that's quite a tough thing to do with a startup and also quite unique proposition . So maybe , um , maybe we were just stupid enough to do it , or brave enough to do it , I'm not sure well , it's definitely one of the two .

Speaker 1 24:31

But you're right , I think that you'll find these things never stay a category of one for long , right ? So there will be others that will be coming to join you in the space , but you will always be the first . So you know , nobody could take that away . Nobody could take that away , and that helps you to be in a position of a leader in this space and really a pioneer for what the category could and should look like . There's the one SKU , excuse me at the moment . When did you launch ?

Speaker 2 25:03

We were in 2023 . We sold our first product , yeah

Developing the range

Speaker 2 25:06

.

Speaker 1 25:06

Wow , okay , great . And how does the future look ? I won't do my lifted joke again . I'd love right now to be playing that song from the Lighthouse family .

Speaker 2 25:17

Oh yeah , what a tune , what a tune .

Speaker 1 25:19

It's a great tune . You should have that on all of your advertising . Of course they would want money .

Speaker 2 25:26

You know when you get the Spotify wrapped at the end of the year , I was like top one percent for lighthouse family 2023 , just because I was playing that song on repeat yeah , everybody over a certain age right now is singing along to that song .

Speaker 1 25:38

Everybody else under the age is going . Who the heck are the lighthouse family ? Yeah , it's a great tune . Guys . Go and check it out . Perfect for summertime as well , definitely , um , so you've got the one for the moment . Is your plan to stay with just the one for now , or do you have , um , some some other ideas in mind ?

Speaker 2 25:56

yes , so we're doing a bit of polling at the moment , a bit of testing , to figure out what the next steps are . Um , we did actually have a ipa and what we found is just like capital wise , it was too much to have the two stews running , so we pulled back on the ipa and we just wanted to focus on on nailing , the nailing , the lager . Um , so we will . It's a toss-up between a ? Um high protein ipa or a creatine . That's right , not creating um electrolyte um beer . So instead of having the protein it would be electrolyte beer .

Speaker 2 26:29

Um , and the other thing we were looking at was making a gluten-free version . So , ticking all the boxes , we can't really do but making a , making the current version like gluten-free . But that seems very , very challenging . So , um , yeah , we might have to pause that one . But ultimately it's down to our customer base . So we're doing polls on linkedin emails out to our customers . We're also putting product on waiting lists as well so that we can just kind of sense what the demand is before we actually go ahead and actually create the item . But I think all the learnings that we've got from the lager , it will help with the development of the next item .

Speaker 1 27:06

And you know , I don't think that's uh a bad thing to have the one skew and to be focused on that . I mean , you know , look at , look at , what lucky saint did they just had one for for six years before they decided to launch something else and they did all right exactly exactly .

Speaker 1 27:26

I don't think that's a bad thing . Um , let's jump back a little bit to the protein element . For those who are listening ,

Why protein?

Speaker 1 27:34

this sounds great , but why do I need protein in my beer ? Can you tell listeners just a little bit about what that actually does for them ?

Speaker 2 27:42

Yeah , definitely so . Protein is the building block of our body , so we need protein in our diet for muscle maintenance , but also for muscle growth , and it's also great for things like bone density as well . So it's really important that we have enough protein in our in our diet . So for like a rough guidance , for every kilogram of weight that you have , body weight wise , you should try and get two grams of protein per day . So for me I am 90 kilos um , I would need to get about around 180 grams of protein per day to to have like a decent amount of protein . Okay , and if you're going muscle growth , you might try and up that a little bit . So somewhere between the 1.5 and 2.5 is good , um , but I would normally try and aim for two .

Speaker 2 28:30

That's very difficult to get because you just think of like high protein foods . Like an egg , an egg's only got seven grams of protein in it . So even if you have three eggs , which you might think , wow , I've had loads of protein today , it's only 21 grams of protein . So if you've got 180 grams , to get after 21 grams isn't isn't an awful lot it's a lot of eggs , it's a lot yeah , too many eggs , um , if you had like chicken breast , for example , that's maybe 30 grams of protein .

Speaker 2 28:54

So all of the grenade bars that you might see in the , the protein shakes that you can buy in the four quarts at petrol station , um , powders that you can buy , they're all just supplements . They're supplements to help you hit that protein goal . They're not intended to be your diet . They're not intended to take away from your meat , your beans , your eggs , all the other ways you get protein . They're just there to help you hit those goals , because it's really hard to to hit them . So we see ourselves as just another way to get to hit those protein goals , especially , you know , if you're already drinking the non-alcoholic beer version , um , and it's already part of your ritual . If you just sub out that product round product just helps helps you hit your goals . Um , the other thing as well is that quite a lot of those products that I mentioned are very , very processed . So think about , like a grenade bar or , um , let's say , grenade shake or something like that that you might see they've probably got 20 to 25 plus ingredients . And that's the same for powdered shakes and a lot of the other shakes . You'll see , and we've god knows how many stabilizers and they need a chemistry degree to decode what's actually in it , whereas we've only got five ingredients in our product . So we're a very , very , very clean way to get protein .

Speaker 2 30:05

Um , add to that that our product is only 60 calories for the can . It's very , very low calorie . So again , I keep using this example , but a grenade bar is probably 250 calories . A protein shake might be 250 , 300 , 350 calories , whereas our product is only 60 calories . Of which that 60 calories , 40 of the calories come from the protein itself . So every gram of protein contains four calories . So we've got 10 grams of protein per can . So 40 calories of the beer is protein which you have to consume . And then the actual beer itself is only around 20 calories , which is super low . And there are some that are ever so slightly lower that are on that low-calorie side super low . And , uh , you know there are some that are , like , ever so slightly lower , that are on that low calorie side , but it's a very , very low calorie drink and a very clean way to get protein in your body .

Speaker 1 30:56

Wow , thank you for that . That's really , really insightful . No , it's , it's good because I think you know , often you can speak to people about functional drinks and you know they can mention , you know , lion's mane or l-theanine , but I said , but why ? Why do I want that in my drink ? What's it doing for me and how does it fit into to my lifestyle ? Um , but it sounds like this although obviously your sort of ideal customer advertise is around the sports element uh , people either participating or at home watching the footage uh , that this could also fit into . Uh , the last of just your average loner drinker who might need to , you know , up their protein intake exactly that like we .

Speaker 2 31:37

We , let's say , our dream avatar or our audience , is , is , and our marketing is targeted towards um , athletes , um , but it is something that can can help anyone and , as I said , like , if you're already having a non-alcohol beer this is how I feel now anyway then why wouldn't you just have a non-alcohol beer ? Um , that has some additional health benefits for you , that helps you hit and meet those protein goals . So , same way as um . In that confectionery market , instead of going for a cadbury's bar , you're now going to go for an Oreo grenade bar , even though it costs three or four times more , because it's got that big thing that says 20 grams of protein on it . Because you know it's more beneficial to your body and it doesn't taste as good as the other chocolate bar and it's four times more expensive , but you'll still buy it yeah , absolutely , and then she's sort of chewing on it forever with those things my husband eats them all the time it's

Speaker 1 32:32

like this is just it's not worth it . You mentioned , like that , the the health um uh side of beer and that perspective that that people have obviously beer with alcohol . Any health benefits that might be in there is going to be marred by the fact that the alcohol is there . Alcohol-free beer is having its own challenges with things like sugars and other ingredients that might go in there . Now you mentioned that yours is low calorie . I believe it's low sugar as well , and also hops , which obviously is the main ingredients of beer , are actually quite health giving . I think people don't recognize that hops by themselves are actually quite good for you . I don't know all the chemical , scientific reasons why . So it sounds like this could be part of sort of a healthier lifestyle change as well . Is it low sugar as well ?

Speaker 2 33:26

Yeah , yes , so let me just double check . I think it's 0.1 grams of sugar per 100 mil . I was going to grab a can , but pull my whole computer off if I do that . Um , I think it's 0.1 grams of sugar per 100 mil where typical lady eyes on yeah 0.3 0.3 grams per 100 mil so yeah , so one .

Speaker 2 33:49

So it's one gram of sugar basically per can . I think to be considered a low sugar item you have to have less than five grams of sugar per 100 mil , which is crazy . That that's low . But a normal non-alcoholic beer is probably around one to 1.5 grams per 100 mil when we're not free . So probably 30 to 100 like less sugar than a regular non-alcohol beer . So we're definitely low on the sugar side that's fantastic .

Speaker 1 34:18

It sounds like it's got so much uh great stuff going for it .

Speaker 1 34:21

I can really see this as being , uh , like I said , the start of a category that's really going to gain more traction and also in places you know we've mentioned that , the sporting events as well but I know when we spoke before there's it going to gain more traction and also in places you know we've mentioned the sporting events as well , but I know , when we spoke before , it seems to me that there's a great opportunity , because we're talking a lot at the moment about getting more low-end quality , low-end options into venues excuse me for people to be able to have a good choice when they're going out , and I could definitely see something like this in , uh like sort of competitive socializing spaces which are really taking off at the moment yeah , you know sort of what ?

Speaker 1 34:56

what you know , the swingers and that sort of thing yeah .

Speaker 2 35:00

So I think that's an area that we haven't quite nailed yet and that we would really really love to , but that kind of like , yeah , darts bars , mini golf bars , um , shuffleboard bars , like that type of thing , where there's that competitive element and people aren't necessarily going for the night out , they're going for meet up with their mates . It's like , you know , they're not going for a big night out , they're going to do something fun and do an activity . Um , I think that's an area for us where we see a lot , of , a lot of potential . It's just probably , like we said , that we've got a lot going for our product .

Speaker 2 35:29

It's actually quite hard to communicate all of that and you know , we spoke for half an hour now and there's still more I could say about the different things that we've got going for our product . So we have to be very , I suppose , nailed down in what it is we're trying to achieve and what is our main core main like core audience . But yes , I do see , like those , those bars as an area for us . We've not managed to get any listings in anywhere like that at this stage and I think we are still , you know , a bit of an early adopter type of product . So some people get it and they love it and some people still like what's the point ? No , I don't get it .

Speaker 1 36:07

Put the alcohol back in that type of thing so we are coming up against a few challenges and obstacles when it comes to getting those types of listings yeah , I mean , first of all , it's it's early days and the whole category is having that sort of struggle to to get . I mean , obviously there's a few that have done it really well , but people in your position , so it's , it's , it's the ongoing journey , um , it's , it's interesting to you say you know , people are saying you know what's the point , put , put the booze back in . Uh

What's the point?

Speaker 1 36:36

, we're hoping , aren't we , that that that rhetoric is no longer needed , that people are starting to to get it , but not everyone's there yet , are they ?

Speaker 2 36:45

no , I did a crossfit event at the weekend , so remember crossfit . So crazy workouts , fitness community . I pitched up at like 9 am and the first person that came to speak to me goes you've got an alcoholic version . I was like , oh no , not this again .

Speaker 1 36:57

The second person that came to speak to me have you got an alcoholic version ?

Speaker 2 37:00

I'm like no . And then you know , eventually we get that . But you know , and there's the social media trolling A lot of it is about . You know what's the point Make an unpolit version , et cetera . I'm sure if you made an unpolit version , I guarantee you it would do really , really well because of the fact that there would be demand for it . But it completely goes against our brand mission , our values , which is to be brewed for a stronger version of yourself .

Speaker 1 37:30

um , okay , so as much as we could do , that it's not something we would ever ever go into absolutely stand your ground . I mean , this is , this is who you are and , like many of the best founders out there , you , you and your lovely wife have decided to solve for a problem that you know exists because you are facing it yourself . Uh , and yeah , I mean , as you could make an alcoholic version and it probably would fly off the shelves , but that doesn't mean that it's what should be done .

Speaker 1 37:58

You know , leave that to those who are still in the in the in the booze booze booze business exactly . Um , what else do you ? Would you like people to know about Lifted , because you mentioned that there are tons of things that you could say , but in terms of people really understanding the brand , what is it that you would like listeners to know ?

Speaker 2 38:20

So I think , from like a product point of view , just that we are like the only people that are doing this in the uk .

Speaker 2 38:28

Um , you know , and we have been sort of really working hard to to get the , the brand , out there and hopefully , some of you will have already heard of it and know about us , and I think that the other thing is that we really are wanting this to be a product that is for , like you know , the high achievers , the people that you know want to make progress , the people that are putting the work in , the people that are um you know they said , looking after their family , doing the right things , making the right um habits and having the right rituals in place . That's who we are . We , we know we're not for everyone . We , we get that and , um , we're happy with that . We , we embrace that , but we are , are for those people that really want to push themselves and progress .

Speaker 2 39:12

So I think , that's it really , and there's a tendency to always talk about the features of your product in terms of . I'll list them out we're 10 grams of protein per can . We're vegan , we're low calorie , we're low sugar . We've only got five ingredients . We have a lot going for us , and that's the tendency is to always go feature-led , but actually we want to kind of be a bit more led by . This is the product you want to be seen with . Like , if you're at the barbecue drinking a can of lifted , you're the one that's got the status symbol , because you're the one going no , I'm all right , I'm just going to have my can lifted .

Speaker 1 39:46

And that's kind of where we , where we see ourselves

Where to find Lifted

Speaker 1 39:49

nice , very , very nicely said totally uh , let's remind people where they can go and , uh , buy the beer and find out more about you yeah , so it's um liftedbrewingcom , or on instagram it's lifted underscore brewing or on tiktok it's lifted brewing okay , fantastic .

Speaker 1 40:07

um , it's been really interesting talking to you and finding out more about this . I I love , uh , that we get to to bring something that people might not have heard about before , might not have considered before , and hopefully something new for people to try and go and experiment and investigate with . So do go and check it out , guys . Thank you , it's time now , before I let you go , for my final question , tony , which is one that I ask everybody who comes on the pod , because

The BBQ-Q

Speaker 1 40:30

I believe in spreading the low no light love around the world . So you mentioned a barbecue earlier on . You preempted , you knew what question was coming . So we've had some lovely sunny days lately . So barbecue season is upon us and you are off to a barbecue with your wife , with your mates , and you are bringing some great low no drinks along with you .

Speaker 1 40:53

now , obviously , several cases of lifted , of course everybody to enjoy yeah , but other than your own brand , what else would you be bringing along to enjoy a barbecue ?

Speaker 2 41:03

you know what . It might be unpopular opinion , okay , but I do like the uh punk ip non-alcoholic Punk IPA . I think that is because it's so accessible . You can pick it up , like I've got a co-op a few minutes from me and if I'm out of lifted I'll pick up the Punk IPA . If I had a bit more time and foresight and prep and I was ordering in advance the barbecue , I'd probably go for a Big Drop or something like that . It would be a beer . I'm a beer drinker , so I would go for another non-ac beer and I think big drop make really good products . Um , I was drinking them way before we started lifted . They're actually some of the inspiration for , like , what we wanted to achieve and create . So thank you to those and uh , yeah , that's what I would have yeah , punchy flavors with big drop as well yeah yeah , and I was speaking to .

Speaker 1 41:48

I spoke to rob on the podcast many , many episodes ago uh , lovely , lovely chap , and they're really making uh great beers that sort of when you want that fuller flavor , more akin to a fuller , a full strength alcohol , because they've got that sort of hop forward flavor . So that's a couple of great choices there .

Speaker 2 42:08

Yeah , go ahead . As I said , that's what I would go for . I've always been more hoppy aily kind of beer drinker , and that's why I think I've loved their products so much , because I think that they are hot forward and they have a punch , yeah , and I like what you mentioned about the Brewdog Punk IPA , because they are everywhere and it is like I said before .

Speaker 1 42:31

some brands uh are doing very well in the supermarkets as in they're in there . Uh , as I've discussed on many other episodes , just because a brand is in the supermarket doesn't mean they're actually making loads and loads of money . It's very expensive to be in in supermarkets , but it is good that we're now seeing more and more low-no and light products available in more spaces . And it used to be just your big supermarkets . But now you're right If you're popping into someone's house and you haven't got anything , you can now go into your Tesco , metro or your Sainsbury's Local or just your co-op and you can still find options in the smaller stores as well .

Speaker 2 43:07

I think in my co-op we've got and it's only a small one there's Corona Zero , amaretti Zero , peroni Zero , Brewdog . I think there's Adams Zero , which is like an ale , and a couple of ciders . I'm like that's crazy to have all of that selection in a tiny co-op , right to have like five or six options .

Speaker 1 43:29

It's great . It's fantastic the times they really are . A change in tony . There we go . Thank you so much for joining me today . It has been great chatting to you and good luck with everything you're doing . I think it sounds like a fantastic project .

Speaker 2 43:40

Thank you so much having me . It's been a pleasure .